Wake up, Buy Here, Pay Here people. It's a beautiful day. Go grab yourself another cup of Joe and say hello to Jim and Michelle Rhodes on the Buy Here, Pay Here morning show. Take it away, you two. Howdy, howdy, howdy. Happy Wednesday. Welcome, y'all. Welcome. Where are we? We're at home. Oh, yeah. We're not traveling right now. A little groggy this morning. Yeah, it's been a rough start. I've had plenty of caffeine, but still. Happy Wednesday. It's White Hat Wednesday. We talk about the weather, but it's cool enough. I really enjoy getting up in the morning and It's like, I got to throw a sweater on before we go out. We have coffee outside for as long as we can comfortably have coffee outside in the morning. So it's kind of one of our really cool rituals. I highly suggest to anyone out there that has a relationship with someone as a romantic, lifelong, whatever partner. Okay. to uh to take the time to create ritual yeah um and you know where it's like this is a safe time a safe place we can talk about the stuff we can connect with each other and all of that so it's just it's been really really beneficial Michelle has heard me say that the problem with that sometimes is until I've had enough coffee you know, sometimes with my sweetheart, she's, I'm going, she's talkative at times that I'm not necessarily listenative. So that's the, my new word that I've come up with. It's like, I'm just trying to help her understand. Look, I'm not, I need another cup of coffee before I can become listenative. So, yeah, I mean, you know, everyone has their own thing about, are you a morning person, your afternoon person, or you're an evening person. Um, I'm all day person after about 10 minutes. three it's three three minutes and you are on the day's stuff and planning the the landscape projects and yeah it's like you know don't allow me any grace there that's okay that is what is three minutes full on let's get this party started and jim's like looking at me like no words no it's okay she starts but it's like 12 minutes in before I hear anything like You know, before I actually registered. Oh, goodness gracious. Yeah. Okay. So that's our relationship corner for the day. Announcements. Yeah. So we announced yesterday that we're moving forward with V8N. Oh, because we were talking about doing it V8101 and you decided on N. Okay. Right on. And so it's all the same thing. We call it V8101. It's like it's... So I just had a group three meeting last night, which is... That's kind of the first group that we've done that is for beginners, zero to 100 accounts. And I'm just recognizing the more we do this, that it's, it's, it's not practical to try to have the same sort of meeting format with them that we have with the established. Yeah. They don't have as much data to compare. Sometimes they go, some of our dealers didn't sell a single car in the month of July. So they're just kind of figuring it out. Because they've got other side stuff or whatever. So the composite is not really good. So I typically spend the time showing them averages and calculations from the other groups and kind of educating them on these numbers. They're learning. Yeah. yeah let me tell you last night they asked some really great questions that led me to produce some numbers that I've never really thought about when you came upstairs after your meeting you were like I got asked for some stuff and I was like wait I have the data I can come up with that number and so jim who loves spreadsheets was like Numbers nerd. I spit it out for them. Numbers nerd. I do like that. That just rolls off the tongue really nicely. Numbers nerd. And I own that. That's who I am. But it's like they ask questions that were great questions. I mean, two or three great questions from dealers. One guy in Texas in particular has got really great questions. And so... it prompted me in the course of trying to answer his question in a way that would be more visual and easier to grasp what it is that I was presenting. Fantastic. So many people are visual learners anyway. So, yeah. And so his question is now going to, I'm going to be able to take that same information back to our established dealers. And I promise you, they're going to like looking at these numbers too, because it's like, just, it's a new way to think about, I don't hear people talk about this stuff. And so it's a new way to think about, um, some of this stuff. So anyway, we're having a lot of fun. Fantastic. So there are new V8Ns and it's for dealers that are new. And so define new. Just anybody, even if they haven't yet contracted their first deal, they're welcome in those groups. So as early as that and as late as what? 100 accounts. When they get to pretty close to 100 accounts, I'm going to want to move them over to establish. Yeah. So there's a lot of dealers out there that are like that. Absolutely. And so we want to try to help them graduate, so to speak, to one of the other groups. But yeah, that group is more coaching, more education. Yeah. And we knew that going in when you were like, there are newcomers that really need help. And we're like, can we do this in the V8 format? And so we kind of went forward and we realized, I think, where this is going is that we realized that it can it's it makes sense to have it be a v8 thing is like in a group type of thing but it's really not the same kind of format as the other groups because it's like there is a lot more coaching there is a lot more of that kind of stuff going on and so you know it gives dealers an opportunity to to to talk to their dealers and you know am I having a struggle that I shouldn't be having am I and all of that but it also opens up a really beautiful opportunity for seasoned dealer mentors to take a group of newbies and I'm meeting with two people today who have an interest in becoming moderators and so we're going to start them with newcomer groups and so I think this is part of where Yeah, I look forward to being able to go in that direction where we can reach out to because it is proving to be a really great coaching format, group coaching format, hour and a half a month. And we just get together and we answer their questions on the fly. We show them numbers from the other groups so that they can see, okay, here's what the dealers did in July. Here's what their averages look like overall. And it's just so helpful to them to have a lens, you know, on that sort of stuff. So it's, it's really been great. I'm enjoying it. You know, I can see us moving more. I mean, we're, we're not taking clients as much, but more and more towards, if you're going to spend time coaching, it should, that it just makes more sense to do it as much in a group as you can. Cause it's just, you know, Yeah. Whenever possible. So especially with the newbies, which has been our, you know, that's kind of like our shtick has been for a long time is helping new dealers get into business. So it's fantastic. So other quick announcement, I got the other new group five meets tomorrow night. And so that's the first time for them to meet another one. And you've got 500 to 2000. We've got of the, of the group, it's predominantly women. We started where we make sure we have four commitments signed before we start the group. Three out of the first four to sign are women. I think that's a different perspective potentially on different things, different kinds of questions or not. To me, we're going to stick to business. I told them, I said, I'm going to celebrate the fact that you're women and then we're going to get down to work. It's just the same as everybody else wants to learn the same stuff. We do. I mean, I doubt seriously that there's going to, they're going to want to have like a conversation about feelings, but I just think it's, it's there. It's a business matter that they're, they're going to, they're going to potentially have a different view on some of the stuff. Well, and that can be, that can be such a benefit to, to, to, to all dealers. So That's pretty cool. I'm excited for you. And we're continually adding groups as needed and we've gotten a lot of feedback from people that are like, I would like to moderate. One quick other update that ties into our conversation today is both the newcomer group and this group that we're meeting with tomorrow night that's sending in their data for the first time from the month of july they are struggling to get okay this is this is this is like the thing this kind of goes this ties in the whole thing that we've been working with dms's to can you produce this report that can balance out within x percent and many of them are working on and many of them are and we we have there's a there just the last couple of final tweaks and stuff going to be super helpful for dealers there are others that are are are unable to or haven't you know been as responsive but it will help um dealers be able to to to be a good dealer and have good solid numbers well I'm just saying it kind of highlights this problem with dms and reason some people might go through a dms divorce okay is because when the data is so far off, it's like at some point you start to question whether you're with the right software. So that certainly becomes a question. So let's talk about the reasons that you and I see in working with dealers. And we've got dealers. I'm participating in a kickoff call next week. Yeah. I'm just thinking about... Dealer, divorce, divorce, divorce, divorce. You had a chance to get sound effects ready, but you didn't do it. So it's all good. I think thinking about the reasons that we see dealers going through a divorce is, I mean, at ZMS Divorce, is that they, so the list includes things like accounting. Like they can't, some people want like onboard accounting, so they want to go find a software that offers that. Okay, so what that means is that some dealers leave a DMS because they don't have the features that they need or that they want. So it's a feature thing. Yeah, it's features, definitely. And so to me, what also would roll into features would be integrations. Okay. It's huge. Obviously, in the digital technological age that we're moving into, There are a lot of cool add-ons, you know, kind of sister products, if you will, that, you know, it would be nice to be able to utilize that service and not have double entry. So double entry just would be, I got to key it in here and I got to go over to another system and enter it again. The one I can think of the most is like an underwriting software service. that it's like you can work a deal in underwriting software, but it certainly does not push the DMS. And so you got to redo all the stuff and both, both softwares are good and useful, but it is a pain for a dealer to, it's like really, I, I, and when dealers have, when that's happened, it's like, yay. Cause it creates pain. a lot less workload for, you know, and it's, so it's, it's, it's a win when that works really well. So, yes. So features, integrations. You know, you can look at the list, but I think one of the things that happens when we meet, especially dealers that are newer in the business is they they don't fully appreciate what the demands are going to be on that system as they grow again so it's understandable they don't they don't know yet even what and I always tell them when they're new I said you're kind of at this stage you don't even know yet what questions to ask oh yeah it's like pretty hard for you to know one of one of the uh one of the the testimonials for v8 was just like You don't know. I had no idea that I didn't know this stuff. So, yes. For sure. But I think when it comes to this kind of integration stuff, it's like you don't fully appreciate even what's out there in terms of, let's call them add-on tools, like these supplemental tools that you could go get. So you mentioned underwriting. Obviously, there's payment processors. There's CRMs, which may or may not do underwriting. A lot of DMSs have that inside of it. A CRM? Yeah. Yeah. But, but it sucks for a lot of them. I mean, you know, they say, yes, we have a CRM, but it's like, yeah. Okay. So another one is support. Like you hear a lot of dealers complaining about, I can't get support. I, and this is where I like, from coming from an extensive background in customer support. This is one that I feel like, you know, we talk about subject matter. I ask the stupid questions because there are questions that people may want, you know, as we're having a conversation about buy here, pay here, all of that kind of stuff. Customer support is something I can speak to really well. Yeah. And so there are some kind of exaggerated examples in our industry. It's like, you know, we're not going to name names of providers here, but it's basically if you, there are companies that their vision of support is, well, we give you a chat thread available 24 seven. It's like, yes, but the people in that chat are reading from a knowledge base and they don't know the first thing about my business. They don't know the first thing about a buy or pay here transaction or contract. Yeah. And so it's like, yeah, there's, there's, yeah, I can talk to somebody and yes, they know where the buttons are in the software. But when we talk about support, we're really looking for something at a much higher level. So, and support is, weaves into all of these things of course um in a really big way um because most dealers I mean there are there are people out there that their mo is I'm irritated I'm gonna suffer I'm irritated I'm gonna suffer I'm irritated I'm gonna suffer until I am just done and I'm moving right And, you know, that's a problem. And that, you know, we have an opportunity. Dealers and vendors alike have an opportunity to help each other grow. Mm-hmm. help each other get better. And so things like, hey, I'm having a problem with the accounting. We're talking DMSs here. So I'm having a problem with accounting. And I would ask dealers that are listening, if you've got a problem with something with your DMS, then Talk to someone at your DMS. Okay. That's like, Oh, that's like a, what is, what I see happen is they don't know who to talk to. Um, uh, the chat bot is not really, you know, that helpful or like, here, give me a suggestion about what we can do. Not super helpful because there's not just like, uh, a, I matter, uh, to you as a customer type of type of conversation that happens with it. And so, you know, I think the first line of defense in any divorce with a software or whatever is communication. Have you tried to communicate what it is that you, you need now, once that's been communicated, the, it's, it's the, the, um, it's like the balls in your court, right? I mean, there can be a valley, a volley back in, you know, it was like the da, da, da, da, but balls, balls in your court. Um, how can we, how can we help? You know, um, we, the answer might be, Hey, we don't have the capabilities. This is on the roadmap. Hang tight with us as long as they're being honest about it. Or if they can even reach the people to talk to the road back people. Yes, exactly. So I'm going to give a, sorry, the last thing you talked about is nickel and dime policy. That is so frustrating for so many dealers. It's like, yes, we can. but it's going to cost you. And it's like, gosh, darn it. I already, you're the biggest bill I've got every month. Right. And you're asking for more to do something that a lot of dealers are going to benefit from. And so, yeah, it's like that sucks. The one I've seen quite a bit is we're working with dealers and the dealer, we suggest that the dealer would have a certain kind of report. They go to the DMS system and they say, Yeah, we can do it. Let us get it with our tech team and we'll come back with a quote. And I'm thinking right away, I'm upset as a consultant. This is included in other systems for less than they pay less over there than what they're paying for your system. And you want to charge them for programming. And it's like, this is part of what, so again, we're not in that business, but if I were a dealer, I would grow weary of the nickel and dime. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So I mean, so that's like a pretty good comprehensive list of why people want to break up. Right. And what I've seen as I you know, is is and this this is this is something I hear about frequently from dealers and social settings or whatever. It's like, yeah, I call and I don't get an answer. Yeah, I'm reaching out and I just get lip service and then it's back to normal. And we even sat with a dealer friend of ours at the last conference. Dealer friend of ours is like, hey, you know, we we we. like, it's so good to see you. And then that conversation kind of struck up about, Hey, I'm having a problem with this. And I was like, Oh, let's talk to this, talk to the person. And so we were like, Hey, there's a problem with this. And they're asking for some help and you know, all of this. And, and the answer, um, from salespeople is yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We can get onto that. Yeah. Well, here's the person that's respond. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We can get on with that. And then we have a conversation with the dealer three weeks later. How are things going? She's like, like the same. Yeah. And so it's like that ball in your court dropped. Yeah. Because the other thing that you see with support, going back to the stuff about, you know, when you're, when you're on support, a lot of times the best they can provide you as a workaround. But I, I disconnect and I've solved my problem for the moment, but the, but the larger problem will be back tomorrow. And so this is the part that I think that, um, It's if you think now, if we said we're going to have a little fun and make it more like a personal relationship, like it's like you're not listening to me. I'm not you're not hearing my frustrations and what I'm. Yes, I can get on the chat and I can talk to somebody, but I'm not really being heard as a dealer principal, as a business owner. Yeah, my my people can get on and solve the issue of the day and reverse the payment or whatever's got to be a little different. but is it going to happen again? Is it going to happen again? Is it going to happen again? Also dealers get stuck in no man's land. And we've talked about this in the past. It's like, um, They get stuck in no man's land because this is part of why we're asking for copies of contracts, which, by the way, those people who didn't hear last Wednesday's episode, if you have a DMS contract or can get to it, we would like to have you send a copy of your contract to Jim at White Hat Way. Well, actually, it was Allison where I'm. you can find that, but the idea here is that we want to be able to look at that because where I'm, what I mean by no man's land is the DMS has a responsibility to provide support for their product. But when you get to integrations and there's a, let's pick a payment processor, there's a payment processing problem and the software, the DMS is not communicating well with the payment processor like it's supposed to. And we've seen quite a few of these issues circulating on social media where people complaining about a certain provider, uh, but anybody else having a problem here? And, and of course the DMS is like, not my problem. Like everything's good on our side. It all looks fine. You have to talk to the payment processor. And then of course the payment processor all looks good on my side, you know? And so they're stuck over there. The dealer's kind of stuck. Like I still don't have my, my customer's payments still hadn't posted in the software or whatever. I'm picking an example. But it's like, these are the things that for dealers, it gets really frustrating. And to the point where, you know, this is stuff that's hard to know. So part of what we would be advocating for. And so we'll, we'll try to wrap up today with how to avoid, you know, finding yourself in a situation where, you know, again, it's hard to know what questions to ask. How to avoid and how, how to be graceful in, you know, cause it's, it's how to be graceful in that separations. I think a lot of dealers that I work with can be graceful for the first day, maybe the second day. But by the third day, they're losing some grace and they're starting to get pretty upset. Yeah. And on day five, they're reading their contract. Well, exactly. Because, you know, that's the thing is that, you know, it's like how patient should you be? Mm-hmm. especially if you're not feeling heard. So all of you vendors out there, this is a really great conversation for you to be just like, how do we rate on the this? How do we rate on the that? And because what I hear frequently is that dealers are like, I don't matter, obviously. And so I've got to sever ties so that I can move forward in a positive manner, find something else, whatever. And so that's a big thing, too, is that dealers don't feel like their voice matters. And we hear a lot of dealers out there that are like, yeah, it's a problem. here's a work around, you know, it's like, it's just a, what is, but maybe this one is the least expensive. And so that's our reason to stick or, or because of this, because I, you know, but it's like, you just like, no, I guess I just have to deal or, or whatever, but they just don't feel heard. And one of the things, you know, when we talk about how can, how can we help a dealer, um, so that they don't have to is like, for one, that's one of the things that White Hat Way is out there trying to, that we're, that we're doing is we can be a moderator and we can say, all right, dealer, you're having a problem with this. Well, how about if we go to, you know, we, we know that there are other dealers that are having the problem. So how about we go and, and we have a conversation because it's like, it's the last ditch effort. Can we, can we resolve this conflict? And if you can't, then, you know, it's like you've, you've, you've done everything you can, but how great would it be for a dealer? Especially when you're looking at a DMS divorce, which is like hell for most dealers. If you could resolve the problem so that everyone's happy and, How beneficial that would be. And so just even being able to feel like you have a voice, you know, and that your voice matters. And sometimes there's a lot of dealers out there that might be having the same issue. And so instead of, you know, instead of just talking about it on social media, it's like, let's talk to the DMS. Well, that's fine. I think what you're touching on is something that we've never done. We did it in person at the conference, but I think what I can say here is that White Hat Way currently is happy to be a voice on behalf of dealers, and we're at White Hat in doing it, saying we're trying to be the voice of progress. We're trying to be the voice of customer success, dealer success, and ultimately the vendor success as well, right? So that's really where our voice is, and that's what we're happy to do. And so what we're doing today is talking about all the DMS providers and the relationship between all dealers and their DMS providers, and other providers eventually, right? Yep. What we can do though, we haven't specifically expressed this, but I can say that if a dealer is in a stalemate between whether it's a DMS or another provider, you can invite us in to just at least do discovery conversation, we're not trained mediators right but we certainly can play an independent role as mediators and and kind of have those conversations so you can certainly reach out and invite us and we can at least come to a discovery call and then if it reach a place where it's billable because it's taken some of our time then that's one thing but certainly we can come to a discovery call and try to find out what the issue is and try to play a role we're happy to do that as white hat way now the piece that I think the the bigger thing here is is when I think about what dealers how we can work as champions on behalf of dealers here is to be able to you know ask these questions on on their behalf to try to make their experience better yes and and we happen to have a platform to do that very publicly yeah so it's it can be helpful yeah so I think what that gives us a chance to do is Look, we're on your side. If you're listening and you're a DMS provider with some unhappy customers, we're on your side. Like we want to see that go well. We want to see your dealer users have a good experience, be able to serve their customers well. And we don't want to see breakups. Like we want to be marriage counselors and we want to, you know, we want to keep you married. Which kind of takes me to another thing about something I didn't plan to touch on, but let me just kind of quickly. I've been hearing in recent months from some providers reaching out to us. I recognize we have a platform. They would like to help us introduce their system, a DMS, whatever, to the industry. And I've talked to at least three in the last six to eight months that are bringing a pricing approach where they say, we're going to give the software to the dealers for free so long as they use our payment processing hub. That's so dangerous. that's what I think so we're trying to make sure dealers know that so why is it dangerous because well if you step into that agreement and you have all your data now living in this free dms and now you decide you're unhappy with the payment processor are you unhappy with the dms what does that contract look like how can I get out of that contract and and when I leave or or it's like yeah can I have a different payment processor and what does that mean for my payment towards you every I mean so it's like is there is there a plan b right so I would say another thing that we're happy to talk to dealers and probably we can just um start to educate in kind of group environment about what is what a premarital relationship I surprised her with that one. No, we were talking about this last time. He says, what about premarital sex? I was like, you know, I think that a dealer should be able to take a DMS for a test drive. I just do. I think so too. Um, uh, but this is like, okay, it's a demo, but will it, um, you know, take it for a test drive. And I know that's hard for a lot of software providers, DMSs and all that to hear because it's like, you have no idea the, the, um, the work that's involved in creating an environment for a dealer to play. Well, that is hard work. but that actually is something that would be beneficial to all dealers to be able to have, you know, and, and I come from software, having a sandbox that you can, that you can play in. And it's like how to, and not just go through a thing, but it's like, okay, you know, you can take me through and you have someone that shows how everything works. And then it's like, you can do it yourself, right? And you know, this, this is how it works. And then maybe bring your, your general manager. And it's like, okay, this is how it works. We're playing in it. How does this feel? There's still a limitation. Okay. And so I put it on the screen or I didn't put on screen. I put it in the banner, but let me show. So I want dealers to write down that word because the next time they're going through a software. Everyone who works in tech and software understands what a sandbox is. And then the question is, do they have it? Sandbox is a place that you get to get in there and play. But what I want to make sure people know, and this is true for you too, is that sandbox is only going to take you so far because all these systems will do the basics. So I'm going to put a car in inventory. I'm going to add some expenses to it. I'm going to price it, and maybe it's going to automatically upload to my inventory when I check the box. So all that stuff is easy, and they can almost all do that. Now we start to contract the deal. The question becomes, how flexible am I in contracting? What contracts can I choose from? And how much kind of compliance help am I getting there? Are the contracts that are in there compliant? But now, so they'll all stock in a car, price it, contract it and have a method to collect payments if they meet the definition of dms of what we're talking about here so um so if if they'll all do that now the question really becomes it's all these integrations I'm talking about how does it communicate with my gps provider how does it communicate with my payment processor how does it uh push accounting how does it handle rfc accounting like there's all these different layers that you're never going to really be able to demo in the sandbox. So I think it's just really important for dealers to understand what they're buying and what's not. Yes. And so, you know, we've like I've sat back and I've watched Jim walk people through newbies. You know, these are brand new. It's like, what is the most important decision? First decision you got to make besides like your location, getting your license and, you know, all of that, that kind of stuff is your DMS. Sure. And not everybody has the ability to have you who knows a lot of DMSs and already has a deep understanding of how all the different things are working with each other and all of that and knowing, all right, so let's have the conversation. What are your goals? What are you trying to do? Well, that you've acted like a matchmaker for a long time. So it's like, you know, I'm out there looking for this. Well, okay. So let's have a conversation. You fill out this little profile kind of thing. The DMS, we already have their profile. So it's like, these things match the best. Would you like to have a lunch date? Yeah. Yeah, that's good. Yeah. It's just lunch, right? It's just, it's just lunch. So I think, um, that's, that's an interesting thing to think about. I think the other thing I put in here is like, instead of, um, sandbox is like, what is your tech stack? So this is another thing to understand. Again, this is, this is all part of what you would want in your prenup or when you're dating. Yeah. But again, Jim, the problem is that most dealers don't understand. And so that's why we're on the air three days a week is to start to educate dealers about what are the things that matter? What are the questions you should be asking? I mean, we're not necessarily there to hold your hand through the process, but trying to give you good information so that you can make... a somewhat educated decision on the things so you know we need to update the list I've got an old list I haven't been asked for it for a long time but but there are a number of questions that I would want to ask a dms provider oh yeah yeah considering stepping in I think you know here's the thing folks is like if you're considering a dms and you go out on facebook and you say you know, what software are you guys using? What do you like? And so, you know, they'll give you these different options. This one's always served our purpose. It's very budget friendly. Well, okay. Back to the basics, buy a car, price it, contract it. They'll all do that folks. Like they'll all, they'll all handle. I hope I wouldn't call it a DMS unless it will handle inventory sales, contracting collections. Okay. So that's, and then I want some version of, reporting. Like the reporting is obviously where I live as an analyst, helping dealers analyze and know what's going on in their business. And I think this week has kind of amplified that because I've got dealers, I've got dealer CFOs sending in stuff that is nowhere close to balanced. Yeah, which is, I mean, what I'm observing is with our dealers in V8, and we've got some incredibly seasoned dealers. And what's been surprising to me is that it doesn't matter if you're new or incredibly seasoned, that it is a shit show. For like, how are you getting the thing? And it doesn't matter what DMS they're on. There are some that are a little bit more challenging than others, but it's because they don't know where to go, how to create, or even if their DMS is able to. so just to amplify this it's like we're providing them in v8 there's a data reporting form okay so it's you know inventory closing inventory sales numbers that's all easy enough but by the time they fill that out that there's collections numbers how much principal did you collect how much How much interest did you collect? How much principal did you charge off? Right? And so on. And then it has a calculation row. It has a formula row in there that says, okay, you told me that you started the month with this or you closed last month with this, which became your starting balance. And then you added this much in new principal you collected and so on. But it has a formula on there that says, this is how close your numbers are reconciling. And we've showed them on, you know, it's like this is within 1%. This is why we're asking for that White Hat Way portfolio summary. And again, a lot of DMS are very cooperative on that. So we're excited to have that solution. And because of where we live and working with a number of different DMSs and helping dealers get to this information, it's like it amplifies this idea that, wow, if my own people, I hire and pay who knows what to my CFO, and they're sending me numbers because they don't realize it doesn't reconcile. They don't know where to find the stuff. And that's the case. That's what you're finding is it's just like they're – because they might be really – buy here, pay here, I've learned is – a very unique beast. Yeah, it really is. And it's not like you can't just throw someone in here who's familiar with bookkeeping or financial stuff from out in business and throw them in and have them... It's apples and oranges in a lot of ways. It's hard. It is. And I think it's the reason that you're going to hear me continue to beat this drum about, can we just reconcile principle? Can we just reconcile principle and the problem? Every dealer should be able to reconcile principle. And look, some of this stuff gets kind of complex. We've got dealers who do retail and buy here, pay here, and lease here, pay here in the same operation. It's all running the same software. So obviously that becomes a little more challenging to all the moving pieces. But when we've got dealers who are just doing lease your pay here, just doing buy your pay here, then at a minimum, and we've, we've, we've preached about this plenty, but it's like, we want them to be able to know exactly where to capture these numbers because it ties to so many things. Yeah. And starts with portfolio performance, which is one of the things we're first looking at in VA is we want to be able to, let's make sure we got valid numbers that we're working from. Well, and, and, you know, we get that, that this is like, these are our frustrations and that they may be different than a dealer's frustration. Um, but I mean, it all, what all kind of boils down to is even from a vendor side where we have a lot of dealers that are like, there, we're working with a lot of dealers. I mean, I was just like, uh, an email just that I was CC'd in and it's like, well, we've got X amount of dealers on this DMS. We'd really like to get this resolved quickly. And, you know, cause it's going to help everybody. And that, that's a powerful thing to be able to do, um, is to say, we have these dealers. If you need a list, you know, it's like, these are the dealers that we're working with that we need this help. Um, And a lot of dealers as loan islands don't have that. And so what we're trying to articulate is if things are rough, if you're having a challenge and you're having a problem, your first line of attack is, well, first off is, do you have the education you need to be able to use the stuff? Mm-hmm. And if you need to ask for more training or whatever until you feel like you've got it, then that's something that a DMS should be so willing and able to help train so people feel good and confident in what it is that they're doing. Yeah, I'm glad you mentioned confidence because that's something else that we see dealers just lose confidence in their software. Quickly. Yeah. It's like, I can't get to the numbers. Yeah. Well, especially with you that it's like, I just want this. And they understand, yeah, that should be pretty easy. Yeah. And it's like you go in and it's like, not so easy. Not so easy. Why is it not easy? Yeah. Yeah. And so yeah, this is part of obviously why we're working on those things. But I think back to just think about so how does a dealer avoid finding themselves in a in an ugly divorce? First of all, when you're when you're dating, you got to ask the kind of advanced questions like, if we're dating, it's like, how do you feel about having children? That's not the first date, honey. That's not typically something you ask on the first date. How do you feel about kids? What do you do for them? What if I wanted to adopt one or something? No, I think it's just normal questions to ask. If we're really going to be in a marriage that's going to be a long contract and we're going to renew that contract. How does that look? When we talk about a marriage, part of the reason I wanted to make this a marriage conversation is because When we step into that agreement and now you've got all that data over there. Okay. So let's talk about that quickly. It's like splitting assets. Gosh, darn it. It can be hard. Yeah. And so, but it's a question of what assets can come over. Yeah. What is the DMS provider willing to transfer? Well, you know, like in a regular divorce, it's like, well, this is mine and this is yours. And, and so for a dealer to understand, if I were to break up, what's mine and what's yours. Yeah. Exactly. So it's part of why we're asking for copies of contracts and we're starting to collect some of those. But then also it's like just knowing here's generally what I see. It's if if I were to change software and I were, you know, I'm the old software and you're you're now the dealer in the new software. I would, it's easy for you to get to, and I will make available the current inventory. Export the current inventory, move it over to the new software. You could start to market. That shouldn't be hard. Now receivables. What is the customer? Customer Mary Smith has a balance of $10,312.98. Push that over. That's their account balance. So now you can start collecting on Mary's account over there. But what about all that transaction history? What about all the payment history? All the conversations. All the notation. Everything that is so important. It's like most of that stuff in our experience is not going to migrate. And so you have to be sure when you step into a DMS arrangement, and this is why we don't like the kind of the free offer. We're not going to be recommending to our clients that situation where we'll always look again. But it's like when you're offering the customer, the dealer, free DMS, naturally your mind goes, so what's the motivation, right? I guess something's, someone's getting paid somewhere. So you're getting paid on the payment processing side, but what's that contract look like? And then again, if I'm in there and I'm stuck in this contract, do I have to buy my way out of the contract? It's like- You know, that's the part that when you're in there and now you commit to putting all your transactions, all this history that you then want to analyze because you want to go back and test your own performance. Now you move to a new software and a lot of that history is not coming with you folks. And so it's just important to understand in your business. In your arrangement, what does that look like? And so it begs, it starts to say, let's make sure we document, you know, our own stuff, have good records. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Is it's not coming with you? Is it because there's not a pathway? Can't say. It's going to vary by provider. Because, I mean, I'm like so much of the information that we see in a DMS is it can be broken down into a CSV file, right? So can communication like the account history be broken down into a CVS file? CSV. Or CSV, sorry. I can't say. I mean, I don't want to get that technical today, but this is the question. That actually, to me, would be the first thing that a DMS can provide to a dealer is the ability to be able to download all that information so they can store it somewhere on their own or be able to. And it's like, you know, we'll give you the information, but we're not going to be able to push it into the new DMS. But all of the information is there. So it's just how do you, you know, and that's, that's a lot of information to go through, but there are, there are, it, it's, it makes it possible to get all of the things in, or at least a place where you can go, all right, we're going to cross in until we have enough history. We can, you know, your collectors know that you're going to be cross referencing data about this customer. Maybe it's just, you know, you could end up in a scenario where, your collectors have to go look up the history in an old system, or who knows what they're going to use to look at the data from the old system. Well, and that's the thing. So does the dealer have to continue to pay for three years for the course of the thing? We don't know. Yeah. We don't know. That's why we have to look at contracts, and this is why we want dealers to recognize the complications that come along with it. Yes, there are. And it seems so like, you know, when you talk divorce, it's like... Yeah. Sorry, we got a message, but it's obviously spam. But yeah, so hard questions, things to consider. You know, DMSs, it's like this is a real thing. It's a real problem. It's a real opportunity. Right. And so for dealers to start educating yourself on the questions you need to ask, we're trying, you know, we White Hat Way, Jim and Michelle are trying to help you understand these things. That's why we asked you to send your contracts. Into the attorney that's donating time for this. They can take a look through it and then find the things that we need to find so that you understand how that looks. And once everyone knows what all the pieces are, then we can really move forward in a positive way. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. We just want dealers to have access to good information because they got they got a difficult they're in a high risk business or at least one that's perceived as high risk. And it has a lot of moving parts and they have to manage that well in order for that risk to pay off. And so we want them to have good information. And so this is all part of the this is why we brought the subject to a White Hat Wednesday and why We're going to continue to talk about it as an industry-wide matter. It's not aimed at any one provider. It's about helping dealers have good relationships with their providers and ultimately be able to support their customers and lead to success for their customers. Yes. And we talk about V8 an awful lot, but V8 has been a vehicle for just bigger conversations to start happening. And it's like... And we're, we, we try to be, you know, we use the word agnostic, but, um, we, we try to be like, yeah, let's figure out, figure this out. And, you know, this is what you got. And these are the questions that should be asked. And, and, and, you know, the dealers get to make their own choices. We may, we may be a matchmaker or dating service. And it's like, here's some people that we think you should talk to if you're you know, we can help with the conversation. And so it's been, you know, Jim has for a long time wanted to be able to help the plight of a dealer, help dealers get the information that they need, make their business easier to run, help them to be more educated, to to, you know, on the straight line stuff. And then also to, how do we help remove friction between this and this? And V8 has just been a really great way for us to be able to, to, to move forward in that way, in a way that's, even though it's with V8, it's just giving us a different platform or to be able to help all dealers. And so, you know, soup, I just, I sit back and I watch this and it's like, I tell Jim all the time, it's like, I'm really, really just happy for what it is that, that is becoming a reality that you've had as a vision for a really long time. I'm happy for you. And so this is, it's all gonna just benefit all the way around. Um, uh, yeah, just, so we're, we're out there fighting the fight. Yep. Um, and, and we're fighting the fight for all dealers. And we're bringing others to the conversation. I think one of the things we recognize is we can be, we can lead the conversation around a lot of this stuff. Uh, we won't do it ourselves. We can't do it alone. We're going to, we're going to rely on, you know, um, alliances and allies and people to, and we're getting that we're getting people step forward and can play a role in kind of, uh, facilitating a lot of these things. But yeah, this is, um, we certainly have an opportunity to make some real progress in this industry. I think we first have to just identify and speak openly about the things and where the priorities lie. And, and I think this one at DMS, because the DMS is such a, it's such an important backbone to a lot of the businesses that are out there. And so it's a, We want dealers to have a good relationship with their DMS and be happy. We don't want to see ugly breakups where they're saying nasty things about each other on Facebook. Yeah, well, and what we find in V8, though, is that these are not your wildcard dealers. Because there's always going to be dealers out there that are their people. Just people out there that are reactionary and... you know, want to have something to complain about or, you know, whatever it is, this is not, this batch of dealers is not that when they are combined. I mean, there might be someone that's like, but then someone, okay, well let's. And so we're able to, to do like an aggregate of the frustrations, aggregate of the stuff. And so really, really grateful for the opportunity we have to be able to help dealers in that way. And so we're out there fighting the fight for, uh, all dealers. And so we're just, if you're having problems with your DMS, reach out to them, try to get it resolved through, through training. So you can feel more confident, you know, give the DMS is the opportunities to be able to do the thing. And if you aren't getting a resolution, then, you know, then that's like another conversation. And, and, um, in the meantime, just so you can feel more secure, um, is send those contracts so that you know that we can we can help educate you about what it looks like you want to put that on the thing before we wrap up if you have a contract to send you have that or you want me to put it up there I i with this one right here this is um allison at alhlaw.com yeah and you can copy jim at white pathway.com and um And we, we asked for, we, we asked our attorney to do this so that dealers didn't feel like they were just sending stuff to a vendor. Right. And, you know, cause we are ultimately vendors. But that it's like, this is going to someone who understands confidentiality. They understand all of the stuff and they're going to be able to dig into the things that, that the, for the questions that we're asking. And so you basically, by sending that to them, are giving us permission to find the answers in your contract. Yeah, and we're not going to be picking on anybody. We're not going to be naming any names. Nobody will know who the dealer is or the DMS provider. We're going to talk about those in a more generic way. But just quickly to kind of help folks understand, Allison Harrison... We reached an agreement with her in kind to provide this legal support to white hat way for a period of time. And we're now using that to work on behalf of dealers, but also Alison, just for everybody can look her up. She's an attorney with the Ohio independent auto dealers association. So not just, so she understands by her payer. Right. Yeah. Yeah. She's got a lot to offer. And I'll probably LHB, just the automotive industry. She understands. But she's, her firm is lending, um, time to our mission you know why so this is another example yeah yeah absolutely so um thank you a big huge shout out thank you to allison for that um really really appreciate that thank you for all the dealers that have already sent things in um well hopefully next week we'll be able to kind of give you an idea about the ones that we've gotten and you know where we're at with all of that. But, um, you know, just know that we're, we're just out here just beating the drum for, um, you know, how do we, how do we make these things easier and, um, and better and, uh, with less friction, um, with, with all of that. So, um, I think we should wrap up. Hey, everybody. I know it's been, it's long, you know, but, um, We always appreciate you listening in. And it was just a good conversation about the things. And just know, dealers out there, that it is not hopeless. Right. Oh, no. So there can be resolution. And there are people out there that are trying to help. So I hope you guys have a great rest of your week. Again, thank you so much for joining us. We will be back on Friday with what? That was just a recap of the things that everyone's talking about. Some people call it the hot topics. So, all right. Have a great day, everybody. Appreciate you and your support. And we will see you on Friday. Thanks so much.
